i wish you luck my friend

Hi, Rebecca! I've just read this, so here's some shameless self-promotion: #inspirational-images
Our young group for photographers (not only professionals) where you always get a reason (and tips to get better if wanted), when we decline a submission! Feel free to have a look at our gallery and join if you like it! It's automatically approved.
Oh, and thanks for the fave, btw!
Have a wonderful day!

Rebbecca You have no idea how much you have cheered me up today. I am flabergasted just a little to hear someone as good as you is having exactly the same problems as I. You see I thought it was just me that created subpar work all the time. When it first happened to me I thought the problem to be me. !. My work is not very good. 2.I must have offended someone. 3. Maybe I'm a dimwit and didn't fully understand the submission process. 4 My work stinks.
I have had problems with more than one group here. There is one group in particular though that I have belonged to for over three years that has NEVER ONCE accepted anything I have submitted. Like you what concerns me is the fact that I joined the group to learn and so far all I have learned is that my work stinks. Nobody has ever bothered to explain squat to me.

Hi Rebecca,

You and I have been watching each other for a very long time now. And I must say that you journal distressed me. Not because of what you say, it is right on, mostly it is because of my own experience and journey.

Last fall I became involved in a group at the admin level. There were, or supposedly were some experienced photographers in the group. Once can never be sure of course. Certainly there were people who know about photography and cameras, but few of them had any formal training. Over time, I found a great deal of arrogance in how the admins of this group spoke about the submissions. Comments were made about pieces that were either totally wrong (they thought they knew what they were talking about but didn't) or they were judgmental and crude. Very often I found that one person tended to rule the group. If they got there first and made a comment, everyone else just fell into line. And often this person was not correct in their assessment. I found that over and over I was the alternate voice, and if I got there in time, the vote would often turn around once the picture was viewed from a different perspective. At other times, I found that some very good pieces were rejected simply because of the bias of a few individuals and over time I became frustrated.

The interesting thing here is that I was invited to this group to be an admin. I did not ask for the job, and quite honestly I never have. Most of the groups I belong to, I have been invited to join and if I have admin status I have been asked to consider it.

Over time, I became more and more frustrated with the tone and ignorance of the admins. So I left. In doing so, NOT ONE member of that group ever contacted mt to ask why. I on the other hand contacted many members while I was an admin, to ask they they had left. And I found a similar pattern of frustration as you describe.

I think the club idea is a good thing, but I also think that many people are involved for the wrong reasons. They are there for ego... power and control, and not to promote artists and to help people grow. This is very different from my approach, and I find it difficult to stay in groups where this attitude is prevalent. There are lots of people out there who claim to be photographers, and set themselves up as experts, but really have no formal training and are totally unaware of some of the subtle elements of the art. As a result, their knowledge is limited and they frequently make errors in judgement.

I certainly am not sure if other forms of art experience this problem, but certainly I have found photographers to be quite bombastic and arrogant. As a result, I tend to hang out in other crowds.

Your idea of a group is a great idea, but I fear that over time it would just degenerate into the present state of affairs. Giving quality feedback is a difficult thing. Often it requires much more information than is available in the presented image. For instance, I have seen images rejected because of the angle of view. But no one even bothered to ask the photographer if another angle was possible. (There are many other examples too). These are important considerations because photography is not like painting or drawing. We have to work with what is available, most often we cannot simply move an object because we do not want it in the scene. So providing proper feed back on a picture requires one to have an understanding of the challenges that the photographer confronted at the time of taking. No one, in any of the groups that I have been involved in, seems to take this vital element into consideration, rather the vote is a gut reaction to an image, not a thought out consideration.

For now, I have adopted a new process when it comes to groups. There are some that readily accept my work and these I submit to. There are a few that are quite inactive. Overall I make an offer to have the piece included. If it is not accepted or rejected in 24 hours, I withdraw the submission, clear and simple. In my mind, groups should be here to serve the artists, not the other way around. My work is well accepted at dA and beyond, the groups have not really offered me that much so I don't concern myself too much about them. If a group wants one of my pieces in heir collection, I never say no. But I also don't beg anyone for inclusion.

I am beginning to think that the group idea, while good in seed form, has grown a great deal of frustration, and I do not wish to take part in it.

Reba, I've noticed more and more groups do this now, especially when they change admins! Previoualy they would accept an image, but then they change admin and a similar image gets declined, no explanation! It is annoying! You ask why and then they say 'Read the rules!!' Its so impersonal and heavy handed I feel.